PEYOTE WEDDING PICTURE

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D.M.Z wrote
on Feb 28, 2013 2:14 PM

"I have chatted to lots of frame shops here in Alberta, Canada and they have no idea of how to support this huge project on a board to support the weight evenly.  The framing is easy but to do but they have no ideas of how to attach this piece to a foamcore or a mat board to support the weight.

HELP HELP HELP   I'm most frustrated.  And No one has ever seen a HUGE solid bead project ever - they were all in amazement but no help in how to support it.

Got any idea ladies - i'm so totally lost - who would of thought this would be so difficult. lol! "

Kathy, I am going to give you a wild idea or two here..........the biggest I've matted and framed is 8x8, so it is not something I've personally done. And we have NO frame store here with experience either. I had to tell them how to do the one project I took in there. I wouldn't suggest mat board, but foam core will hold up that weight if it is thick enough. 

Think about this idea, it might not be right, but may trigger some other idea. What if you actually sewed the 19x20 picture onto the foam core board. Lay it out flat and make holes in the foam core with an awl, I'd do at least 1" apart on row two or three of the picture, drop down a few rows and do another like it but not right under the first group. I'd do maybe 4 or 5 rows of that, literally stitching up through the foam core, around a thread in the work, then back down. I'd also knot every so often just because I'm paranoid. So now you have a sort of "net" holding the top of the picture to the foam core. See if that feels ok by holding up the picture and judge if it is pulling to much or not. If it doesn't feel like enough, do more rows like that.  If it feels ok, I'd then go down and randomly sew more onto the foam core. I'd also tack the edges a bit. You are aiming at taking the tension off the beads and thread you used so it needs support. I'd also think about double sided tape as you work down with the sewing, like between sewed rows as I've found the tape adds to the stability. One of my pictures is totally taped on the back, with no other backing and was then framed, I did it as an experiment and so far (a couple of years) it is still holding in place and not sliding down to the bottom of the frame. 

Also, I'd make the foam core board to the size of the frame you want to use, like 24x24 or whatever, leaving edges. When the piece is successfully sewed to the foam core, take it back to the frame shop and have them MAT the piece from your 19x20 to the outside edges, maybe with a double mat or single depending on how "deep" the beads are. This will protect the beads from mashing into the front glass. Of course non-glare glass and a deep enough frame. 

Hope this helps, or at least gives you ideas to start with. Keep us posted. Donna

This is all from my mind, but I have a tendency to engineer things in my brain, especially with materials that are familiar to me, like beads and frames. 

 

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tcwhit wrote
on Feb 28, 2013 8:46 PM

Was thinking along the same lines as you Donna. BUT.............. Couldn't the weight pull on her 'netting' and just cut through the foam board? What if she used a small paint roller and rolled out glue on the foam board instead, and put her project on the glue covered board just like you would wallpaper or contact paper? Then perhaps a good think layer of polyurethane (check for discoloration, some of them have the UV business covered). Just a thought, a more of a project. But I think it might work. And I'm also thinking maybe something other then a foam board. Some more like a piece of wall panel or some other thin wood?

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ottercat wrote
on Mar 1, 2013 12:24 AM

stitchngirl:
The framing is easy but to do but they have no ideas of how to attach this piece to a foamcore or a mat board to support the weight.
Kathy:  Just another idea -- how 'bout using Donna's sewing idea, but sew to a piece of duck cloth (canvas) instead of form; then mount to a form core or a thin board by wrapping the edges of the duck cloth and securing to the back (similar process of making a canvas -- for a painting (part of class -- had to learn to make my own canvas, instead of buying a pre-made one)).  Leave the same amount of room on all sides of your work for framing.  I mounted 'Winter Tree' hanging (in Reader's Photo Gallery; detail photo doesn't show framing) on duck canvas (only sewn along top of piece, sides and bottom loose), then attached canvas to a wooden framework with a thin board under my piece & canvas.  Did this in March 2006; hung in a display for two months, put in 'storage' for several months, then hung in my office (MHP) for four+ years; now in my closet.  No problems so far with sagging (curvy bottom edge from the start -- because I didn't work it from the bottom (bits & pieces)).  I would think that peyote would hold up with the same results as 90DO-L, but with your entire work secured as Donna suggested, yours should be fine (mine only secured at top of my work).  Love your piece and impressed with your craftsmanship.  Hope you find a way to frame this to your satisfaction.  Let me (I mean us) know how this turns out.  Best to you.

Ottercat Coffee

02-28-13 (2224 PST)

Be yourself.  Everyone else is already taken.  ~ Oscar Wilde

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D.M.Z wrote
on Mar 1, 2013 12:57 AM

TC and Otter...........both of you have a good point, maybe the foam core would NOT be strong enough to hold. Originally my first thought was glue or double sided tape, the thick kind that you hang pictures or posters with not the thin stuff like scotch tape. But I don't know if that tape has any sort of length of service in it, will it fall apart in 3 years? I have sewed one of my pictures to a microfiber backing and then folded the material over a board and that in turn was mounted in a shadowbox type of frame, but it was much smaller .......... still might be the most stable method.

I was really trying to think of a way to mount it without making any substantial change to the woven piece, but that may not really be possible. Otter's idea of mounting the bead work onto a cloth might be the best overall no matter how you finished it off. The beads and cloth would remain the stable part of the art work, if it changed later and Kathy wanted to hang it on a dowel or some other method, it would be easy to remove the frame and do so. I am always concerned with the future of a piece.

Brainstorming works! The more the merrier......... Donna

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Handcrafted wrote
on Mar 1, 2013 5:20 AM

I am left speechless.

This is beautiful and the hours of work that it must have taken blows me away.

Every time I pop buy for a look at the forum I find something new and beautiful. 

There is a lot of talent out there working with there beads

Julie 

Handmade jewellery designs found here

 

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on Mar 1, 2013 12:42 PM

cool!!.. ^_^

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stitchngirl wrote
on Mar 1, 2013 3:05 PM

WOW ladies - Thanks for all your ideas and thoughts - it certainly gives me alot to think about and get figured out.

As this piece will be an heirloom my goal is to frame this piece -that is my thoughts I keep running thru my head. lol!

Keep the ideas coming - I love when everyone gets there thinking caps on to help a fellow beader.

I was very sad when none of the frame shops had any bright ideas as they had never seen such a thing.

Kathy

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D.M.Z wrote
on Mar 1, 2013 6:57 PM

Kathy, I wouldn't hold it against them, it is all exposure. I'd bet if you lived near Portland OR, or Milwaukee? WI (where they do B&B show), or some other city with a large bead society you would find frame shops that had done this type of thing. 

My local frame shop knows all about needlework framing......... that is what they do the most of, but they didn't have any shadowbox type frames either. So it is what they have to work with most and what they've been exposed to that determines what they know how to do. I had to tell them how to do the mat for the piece I took in...........somehow the fact that it was beads messed with their mind....... Donna

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Valbeads wrote
on Mar 2, 2013 3:31 AM

I agree with Sue, Kathy.  Putting the portrait in a shadowbox along with some other sentimental items would make a beautiful heirloom that could be passed down through the generations.

Glad you're back!

Val

boutiquev.us

 

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stitchngirl wrote
on Mar 2, 2013 11:55 AM

Hi Donna

Yes same here Frame shops know how to do needleart but BEADS not at all.

Come H E ! ! or high water I will get this figured out. lol!

Kathy

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D.M.Z wrote
on Mar 2, 2013 12:06 PM

Kathy, and considering that you got the picture done, with new techniques and corrected the two tiny errors..............I am POSITIVE you will get the framing sorted and done also. You Go Girl. Donna

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ottercat wrote
on Mar 2, 2013 9:43 PM

After all that's been said (here), I've decided to frame 'Winter Tree' in the near future (was just a quick way to get ready for display); would look much better (and it's my hubby's favorite).  The shadow box (with associated items) is a great idea for your heirloom piece.  I agree with Donna, everything will turn out wonderfully.

Ottercat Coffee

03-02-13 (1942 PST)

Be yourself.  Everyone else is already taken.  ~ Oscar Wilde

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stitchngirl wrote
on Mar 5, 2013 12:33 PM

I just had a thought ladies and wanted to run this idea by you all?  What about tacking it to a piece of fabric - not sure what kind of fabric - any ideas of what kind of fabric?  and then stretching the fabric over the matboard or the foamcore?  What do you think?

Still  not sure how to get a bead needle and thread inbetween the delicas without breaking the beads?  What kind of thread do you think a person should use?  I did the project with fireline 8 lb.

How many places to tack it - every so many inches all the way accross and down?

Kathy

 

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stitchngirl wrote
on Mar 5, 2013 12:36 PM

okay ladies I have offically lost it - ottercat suggest the fabric idea - good lord ladies i'm losing it  - this is bugging me so bad its crazy I tell you crazy. lol!

What is duck canvas - Ottercat

Kathy

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ottercat wrote
on Mar 6, 2013 3:13 AM

Kathy:  Take a deep breathe and relax -- you've gotten this far (time constraints, two error repairs).  You'll get this worked out.  (Donna also suggested a similar solution using microfiber (instead of foam) to tack your work to.)

Duck canvas is a heavy woven cloth (sail canvas; white, other colors) that is used for luggage, canvas bags, sails (boats), and painting canvases (just to name a few uses).  Do you have access to a fabric store or another source ('JoAnn's Fabrics' for example)?  What you are looking for is a fabric that will hold its shape under the weight of your piece; neutral shade (cloth color won't 'bleed' thru (visual) -- change bead colors); easy to sew/tack your piece to and secure to a thin firm base that can be framed. 

As for attaching your piece to cloth:   I would secure the cloth in a framework (frame used for counted cross-stitching or similar); then sew the bottom of your piece to the cloth; leave enough border area (for securing to a base) on all four sides.  From the top of your piece, roll outwards down (into a loose tube) to the attached bottom (if it will -- gently).  Roll up (from the bottom) a portion ( an inch, or more) and tack to cloth by going thru a bead (maybe once an inch -- or -- # of beads between tacking) from side to other side (horizontally).  Repeat as you unroll upwards until the top of your piece is attached to the cloth; then sew/attach each side. I've been 'brain storming' methods to redo 'Winter Tree' in the same fashion.  What I may have to do is use a nylon sewing thread (these glass seed beads have sharp edges; size 11) to tack to the duck canvas, because I'll be going thru a bead to tack to cloth; if I go between the beads, it may pucker instead of staying flat.  I'll start with the bottom so I can see what I'm doing and the bulk of my piece will be where I can hold it (rolled up). Ideally the same method that I'm suggesting for yours.

If you could, it might be better to practice with another piece until you are comfortable with the method you choose.  Hope this helps some.  Maybe Donna could explain how she tacked her piece to the microfiber.  Small or large, weight may factor in the type of cloth, thread strength, and how often to tack the piece to cloth.  I'll leave framing to the experts.  Hope this helps -- let us know how you're doing.  If illustrations would help -- I'll see what I can do.  Thanks for sharing your experience.  Remember to write up a history to include with this heirloom for your descendents (written better than just memory).

Ottercat Coffee

03-06-13 (0112 PST)

Be yourself.  Everyone else is already taken.  ~ Oscar Wilde

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