Bead Names vs Bead Numbers

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JannM wrote
on Jun 11, 2012 5:22 PM

i've just spent a frustrating half hour trying to find a bead from the june/july Beadword magazine with no results. i love the idea that the bead names are now listed, but to tell you the truth, the name is often whatever the seller decides to list it as. so far i've seen at least 2 and sometimes 3 names for the same bead.

it would make the search so much easier if, instead of bead names, bead magazines would list the bead number because that is almost always universal. this would eliminate much of the search that goes on when trying to find a specific bead mentioned in an article. i realize that sometimes a seller will add something at the beginning or end of the bead number to identify it in their inventory, but i believe the basic number is still inside all that.

this is just a thought i've had over the years that pops up everytime i can't find a certain color of bead, many times not even at the place listed in the source section of the pattern. but that's a thought for another day.

hugs,

MrsMo

My Lulu Store: http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/beadingforsouthpaws 

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carolee1945 wrote
on Jul 26, 2012 9:07 AM

Wow, I really relate to this!!!  What about using beads in projects that are impossible to find, and for which a substitution is just not possible?  

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D.M.Z wrote
on Jul 26, 2012 1:46 PM

I agree with both of you in your frustration..........but you might just find the numbers have a chance of not being much better depending on who manufactures the beads, or sometimes who is selling them. One big retailer tries very very hard to accomodate everyone with accurate mfg numbers embedded in their codes and thanks to them!!! However there are other companies who seem to have a much different mindset and will change the original numbers so that you have to purchase from them..........I crossed them off my list because I find their tactics counterproductive.

Mistakes are made in patterns, both in the pattern itself and in the colors/numbers area. I have a tendency to try to use all Miyuki beads if that is what is indicated, but most often will not make the same colorway because I am not going to go out and purchase beads just to mimic a magazine project. But that is me. Sometimes the colorway in the mag is right up my alley and I go with it, and usually have those beads in my stash. But if they suggest a Toho size 8, I try to use the same just because it is going to work correctly.

If the store recommended in the pattern doesn't help out.........boy, that is bad. I've called some of those stores and just ordered beads from them and find they are usually very helpful. Sometimes they repackage and so you never really know what you have got, but usually a good bead store knows who is promoting them (often the bead artist's store which is good) and is up to date on what is needed for the pattern. It certainly behooves them to do so.

As far as using one of a kind beads..........after you have collected for a while you will have some of these. You are no doubt expected to use something different in your own piece. But it does cause extra work to have to search all over before you find the bead is distinctive or no longer made with no note to that fact in the article. Take care and think creatively when working on a magazine pattern. Donna

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JannM wrote
on Aug 1, 2012 1:15 PM

i have a friend with both an online and physical store. when talking to her about this situation, she says that most of the time there isn't a color name to the beads she gets from her supplier, but there's always a number. you are correct d.m.z in suggesting that some retailers will use their own numbering and/or color name systems to try to get you to buy from them alone. cindy isn't one of them, thank goodness! she uses the numbers the supplier uses, so if they've changed it for some reason there isn't much she can do about that.

i've run into a couple of online stores who renumber for whatever reason, and i won't shop there unless there absolutely isn't another option. from what i understand [and please correct me if i'm wrong] most of the time retailers don't mess too much with the miyuki numbering. but miyuki doesn't add a color name, so that part if left up to the sellers. like i said, sometimes you can go to 3 different online stores and see 3 different names for the same bead. LOL

i'm very color oriented, so the majority of the time the reason a piece will draw me is because of the colors used in it. that being the case, i will try very, very hard to make it according to the designer's choices of colors. occasionally, i do venture off on my own and venture off the suggested colors [tho most of the time it's going to be a combo of red, black, white and/or silver] Yes i also love to use colors that are only subtly different, especially in frosted whites and silvers.   

well hopefully, we've given publishers, retailers and others something to think about. all things being equal, i'd still rather see a color number than a name. but i'm only 1 of how many, many beaders out there? Wink

Jann [who really needs to figure out how to change her sig line. sigh]

My Lulu Store: http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/beadingforsouthpaws 

♥:♥~j~♥:♥

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shanks wrote
on Aug 2, 2012 8:59 PM

I use to buy beads from the Czech Republic and they have a very neet system. Every factory uses the same number to represent base colors ie: 0003 is always crystal, 2398 is always black.  Each base color has the same number, so a 6002 and a 6008 will always be the same color except for the shade.

Why the shops over here change the color system of Czech beads is dumb.  Also when a Czech beads starts with 111 it is a pressed bead, and 151 is a fire polished bead.

Good beading

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JannM wrote
on Aug 3, 2012 11:27 AM

i don't really understand why they change the numbers either unless it's to make it so you have to order from them to get that specific bead as has been mentioned in this discussion before.

i still stand by my original thought on this in that it would be soooooooooo much easier to find a specific bead given in a design if a number was used instead of [or with] a color name. i realize there's always a chance for error [especially if you are numerically dyslexic like i am LOL] but being able to go to any online or brick store and ask for that number would seem easier and faster in the long run. what you call teal may look aqua to someone else, LOL but DB201 is going to be DB201 unless there's a typo or something.

great discussion everyone. thanks for your input! 

My Lulu Store: http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/beadingforsouthpaws 

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mosshollow1 wrote
on Aug 19, 2012 8:06 AM

OK, here's the flip-side of the coin:

As consumer's you want to "shop" for best  price/exact match; bead retailers (both in stores and at bead shows) cannot afford to be used as "showrooms" so you can see what a color or bead looks like and then go order it from one of the on-line retailers.

So, as the web stores grow local bead stores and innovative vendors at bead shows dwindle.

Here's a true story, you answer the questions.  Most of you know that I've developed the kumihimo program for the BeadSmith, and know something about the technique.  At a show last fall a group of woman spent at least 20 mins. at my table asking questions and trying out kumihimo.  About 15 mins.into the conversation one of them asked if they could get supplies cheaper on-line at Art Bead.(She specifically said ArtBead but I also get FMG, Shipwreck, Fusion, etc)

Now, if you were paying $750 for space at a bead show, with only the income from your sales to cover your expenses and provide your sole means of support,  and had graciously given 1/4 hour of your time and knowledge how would you respond to this woman?

I have no idea if Art Bead even sells kumihimp supplies and she & her friends all purchased form me; but how would you respond?  Would you continue to answer her questions (with other customers waiting for your attention) or would you tell her to go ask the staff at Art Bead?

It's a 2 way street ladies.  If you see a project and the designer offer kits or supplies specific to the project; purchase it from the designer.

If the designer used a bead that's been in storage for a while, it may no longer be in production.  In fact, this is the case with a project of mine that a magazine ran just this month.  I sent them a pile of braids to choose from and one that they chose uses a color of rattail and a bead that are no longer in production.

Go with the flow; use the project for inspiration and if it's a stitch that require a specific size of bead, then stick with the manufacturer and size and rework the colors.

 

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D.M.Z wrote
on Aug 19, 2012 12:39 PM

Moss Hollow, perfect advice. I agree 100% with you on your theories. If I see a vendor and like the project I'll buy the kit right then and there........ sometimes if you delay it is no longer available or not in the color you want....Then you sit around and mentally kick yourself for not nabbing it, that has happened to me, I learned from it.

I totally dislike people who grill you on what it is, where it came from, what the color is and then walk away. I used to sell vintage costume jewelry specializing in 1930's through 1950's and when someone would walk away from a piece...........well, their chances of finding it "cheaper on ebay" was right there between slim and none. I knew that and I'd try to tell them that. I developed a real customer base though by being willing to talk and explain and educated people. So hopefully you are gathering customers when you stand and talk to them. Donna

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JannM wrote
on Aug 19, 2012 2:33 PM

i've worked at gem faire with my business partner and i totally get what you're saying about the dilemma it puts you in. however, my motto is customer service when possible, so while i wouldn't be impatient or rude to someone like that, i would just respond that i wouldn't know if artbead [or someone else] sold the items cheaper or not. i'd keep making eye contact with the other customers hanging around and after a decent time excuse myself to go try to help them. it's a fine line, and the reason i don't do a lot of the shows is because my patience can wear thin in a hurry when someone is trying to monopolize my time while others want help too. but if i'm in that situation, i definitely try to do the best i can and not let them leave angry.

as far as kits and things go, i am prone to buying them when i really want to do a project and just cannot find the materials anywhere else. this is the case with a recent project in one of the bead mags. after spending literally hours trying to find the cabs the designer used [i couldn't even find them at the source she cited!] i ended up buying a kit in gold and silver, paying thru the teeth for them  but since i really wanted to make the project and the materials were available nowhere else, i bit the bullet. the thing is, the cabs had to have a specific back to work with the way the project was designed and i had a group of over 3000 people helping me look and they couldn't find them either, so it wasn't just me. LOL

i don't think it's fair to the consumer for a designer to use materials that are no longer available in a design that they're selling to the public. if i have a "disability", it's that i have a real problem trying to 'wing' it when it comes to using substitute materials in a design. what seems obvious to you or someone else, just isn't always that obvious to me. and if i see a design that i fall in love with because of the color combos, it's very frustrating to not be able to make it in those colors. there are a couple of designers i won't buy patterns from any longer because they travel the world buying vintage and rare materials, incorporate them into a design and sell the patterns. i've gotten burnt more than once with this, and just won't revisit that frustration no matter how much i like a design.

you're right, it is a two-way street, but i think sometimes designers forget that not all of us are world travelers or can afford to buy a kit in order to make something. in the patterns my business partner and i create, we try VERY hard, sometimes even changing parts of a design or remaking the project in a different color if we can't cite a source for the original materials. i think that's only fair to our customers and believe me, they appreciate it. 

i guess my bottom line is if you're going to cite a source for the materials for your designSleep then please make sure they still have them, have the colors you've used [for those of us who are color challenged LOL] and at least give a phone number or some other contact info, because that's not always given either. all i'm asking is to be able to make the project as shown if possible. of course i can change the colors to suit me, but many times the colors given suit me just fine. i'm just saying...

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